Paul Rossi and Jordan Peterson – a MUST LISTEN interview for all parents @JennyHatch
I have been watching this interview off and on all day. At times I found myself weeping right along with the two men who are talking about what they have given up for speaking up and making their voices heard.
Here is a clip from the interview describing the student/teacher controversial discussion about self care that started everything for Paul:
I Refuse to Stand By While My Students Are Indoctrinated
Children are afraid to challenge the repressive ideology that rules our school. Thatâs why I am.
I am a teacher at Grace Church High School in Manhattan. Ten years ago, I changed careers when I discovered how rewarding it is to help young people explore the truth and beauty of mathematics. I love my work.
As a teacher, my first obligation is to my students. But right now, my school is asking me to embrace âantiracismâ training and pedagogy that I believe is deeply harmful to them and to any person who seeks to nurture the virtues of curiosity, empathy and understanding.
âAntiracistâ training sounds righteous, but it is the opposite of truth in advertising. It requires teachers like myself to treat students differently on the basis of race. Furthermore, in order to maintain a united front for our students, teachers at Grace are directed to confine our doubts about this pedagogical framework to conversations with an in-house âOffice of Community Engagementâ for whom every significant objection leads to a foregone conclusion. Any doubting students are likewise âchallengedâ to reframe their views to conform to this orthodoxy.
I know that by attaching my name to this Iâm risking not only my current job but my career as an educator, since most schools, both public and private, are now captive to this backward ideology. But witnessing the harmful impact it has on children, I canât stay silent.
My school, like so many others, induces students via shame and sophistry to identify primarily with their race before their individual identities are fully formed. Students are pressured to conform their opinions to those broadly associated with their race and gender and to minimize or dismiss individual experiences that donât match those assumptions. The morally compromised status of âoppressorâ is assigned to one group of students based on their immutable characteristics. In the meantime, dependency, resentment and moral superiority are cultivated in students considered âoppressed.â
All of this is done in the name of âequity,â but it is the opposite of fair. In reality, all of this reinforces the worst impulses we have as human beings: our tendency toward tribalism and sectarianism that a truly liberal education is meant to transcend.
Recently, I raised questions about this ideology at a mandatory, whites-only student and faculty Zoom meeting. (Such racially segregated sessions are now commonplace at my school.) It was a bait-and-switch âself-careâ seminar that labelled âobjectivity,â âindividualism,â âfear of open conflict,â and even âa right to comfortâ as characteristics of white supremacy. I doubted that these human attributes â many of them virtues reframed as vices â should be racialized in this way. In the Zoom chat, I also questioned whether one must define oneself in terms of a racial identity at all. My goal was to model for students that they should feel safe to question ideological assertions if they felt moved to do so.
It seemed like my questions broke the ice. Students and even a few teachers offered a broad range of questions and observations. Many students said it was a more productive and substantive discussion than they expected.
However, when my questions were shared outside this forum, violating the school norm of confidentiality, I was informed by the head of the high school that my philosophical challenges had caused âharmâ to students, given that these topics were âlife and death matters, about peopleâs flesh and blood and bone.â I was reprimanded for âacting like an independent agent of a set of principles or ideas or beliefs.â And I was told that by doing so, I failed to serve the âgreater good and the higher truth.â
He further informed me that I had created âdissonance for vulnerable and unformed thinkersâ and âneurological disturbance in studentsâ beings and systems.â The schoolâs director of studies added that my remarks could even constitute harassment.
A few days later, the head of school ordered all high school advisors to read a public reprimand of my conduct out loud to every student in the school. It was a surreal experience, walking the halls alone and hearing the words emitting from each classroom: âEvents from last week compel us to underscore some aspects of our mission and share some thoughts about our community,â the statement began. âAt independent schools, with their history of predominantly white populations, racism colludes with other forms of bias (sexism, classism, ableism and so much more) to undermine our stated ideals, and we must work hard to undo this history.â
Students from low-income families experience culture shock at our school. Racist incidents happen. And bias can influence relationships. All true. But addressing such problems with a call to âundo historyâ lacks any kind of limiting principle and pairs any allegation of bigotry with a priori guilt. My own contract for next year requires me to âparticipate in restorative practices designed by the Office of Community Engagementâ in order to âheal my relationship with the students of color and other students in my classes.â The details of these practices remain unspecified until I agree to sign.
I asked my uncomfortable questions in the âself-careâ meeting because I felt a duty to my students. I wanted to be a voice for the many students of different backgrounds who have approached me over the course of the past several years to express their frustration with indoctrination at our school, but are afraid to speak up.
They report that, in their classes and other discussions, they must never challenge any of the premises of our âantiracistâ teachings, which are deeply informed by Critical Race Theory. These concerns are confirmed for me when I attend grade-level and all-school meetings about race or gender issues. There, I witness student after student sticking to a narrow script of acceptable responses. Teachers praise insights when they articulate the existing framework or expand it to apply to novel domains. Meantime, it is common for teachers to exhort students who remain silent that âwe really need to hear from you.â
But what does speaking up mean in a context in which white students are asked to interrogate their âwhite saviorism,â but also ânot make their antiracist practice about themâ? We are compelling them to tiptoe through a minefield of double-binds. According to the schoolâs own standard for discursive violence, this constitutes abuse.
Every student at the school must also sign a âStudent Life Agreement,â which requires them to aver that âthe world as we understand it can be hard and extremely biased,â that they commit to ârecognize and acknowledge their biases when we come to school, and interrupt those biases,â and accept that they will be âheld accountable should they fall short of the agreement.â A recent faculty email chain received enthusiastic support for recommending that we ââofficiallyâ flag studentsâ who appear âresistantâ to the âculture we are trying to establish.â
When I questioned what form this resistance takes, examples presented by a colleague included âpersisting with a colorblind ideology,â âsuggesting that we treat everyone with respect,â âa belief in meritocracy,â and âjust silence.â In a special assembly in February 2019, our head of school said that the impact of words and images perceived as racist â regardless of intent â is akin to âusing a gun or a knife to kill or injure someone.â
Imagine being a young person in this environment. Would you risk voicing your doubts, especially if you had never heard a single teacher question it?
Last fall, juniors and seniors in my Art of Persuasion class expressed dismay with the âGrace bubbleâ and sought to engage with a wider range of political viewpoints. Since the BLM protests often came up in our discussions, I thought of assigning Glenn Loury, a Brown University professor and public intellectual whose writings express a nuanced, center-right position on racial issues in America. Unfortunately, my administration put the kibosh on my proposal.
The head of the high school responded to me that âpeople like Louryâs lived experienceâand therefore his derived social philosophyâ made him an exception to the rule that black thinkers acknowledge structural racism as the paramount impediment in society. He added that âthe moment we are in institutionally and culturally, does not lend itself to dispassionate discussion and debate,â and discussing Louryâs ideas would âonly confuse and/or enflame students, both those in the class and others that hear about it outside of the class.â He preferred I assign âmainstream white conservatives,â effectively denying black students the opportunity to hear from a black professor who holds views that diverge from the orthodoxy pushed on them.
I find it self-evidently racist to filter the dissemination of an idea based on the race of the person who espouses it. I find the claim that exposing 11th and 12th graders to diverse views on an important societal issue will only âconfuseâ them to be characteristic of a fundamentalist religion, not an educational philosophy.
My administration says that these constraints on discourse are necessary to shield students from harm. But it is clear to me that these constraints serve primarily to shield their ideology from harm â at the cost of studentsâ psychological and intellectual development.
It was out of concern for my students that I spoke out in the âself-careâ meeting, and it is out of that same concern that I write today. I am concerned for students who crave a broader range of viewpoints in class. I am concerned for students trained in ârace explicitâ seminars to accept some opinions as gospel, while discarding as immoral disconfirming evidence. I am concerned for the dozens of students during my time at Grace who shared with me that they have been reproached by teachers for expressing views that are not aligned with the new ideology.
One current student paid me a visit a few weeks ago. He tapped faintly on my office door, anxiously looking both ways before entering. He said he had come to offer me words of support for speaking up at the meeting.
I thanked him for his comments, but asked him why he seemed so nervous. He told me he was worried that a particular teacher might notice this visit and âit would mean that I would get in trouble.â He reported to me that this teacher once gave him a lengthy âtalking toâ for voicing a conservative opinion in class. He then remembered with a sigh of relief that this teacher was absent that day. I looked him in the eyes. I told him he was a brave young man for coming to see me, and that he should be proud of that.
Then I sent him on his way. And I resolved to write this piece.
CORRECTION: The anecdote about Glenn Loury was originally attributed to the head of Grace Church School. In fact, those statements were made by the head of the high school. Apologies for the error.
I am extremely proud to publish this piece by Paul Rossi. If you are a teacher who finds yourself in a similar situation; if you want to speak out but are afraid to risk your job; if you believe that political indoctrination has no place in schools, Paul would love to hear from you.
Write to him at: teachingfortruth@gmail.com
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